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PostPosted: July 24th, 2016, 7:06 pm 
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King

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A slightly altered version of my proposed language above, reflecting the community debate, discussion, and oversight that took place all throughout the conceiving of this language. I believe that if we ultimately decide to alter our current legal recognition of contractual law this language is descriptive, to the point, and effective in making the change that we are nearing agreement on.

Contracts, Treaties, and Multilateral Agreements arranged between realms recognized under the Council of the Crowned shall be legally recognised and enforceable by the Imperial Court if the contract in question is fully and publicly declared and detailed in the Imperial Court. Legally recognised contracts are subject to the scrutiny of the Imperial Court and may invite enforcement by way of a civil case if any party subject to the contract in question provides evidence of impropriety by any party subject to the contract.

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PostPosted: July 24th, 2016, 7:11 pm 
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Are all inter-realm agreements included in this?

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PostPosted: July 24th, 2016, 7:45 pm 
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King

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The inter-realm aspect is specifically referenced by the 'between realms' language at the beginning.

My proposed current language allows inter-realm contracts to be legally recognized if they are posted in full detail in the Imperial Court on the forums. I believe this aspect must be included so that the contract is publicly available as evidence to an impartial Imperial Court; this is necessary so that any impropriety on the part of any party subject to the contract can be checked against an impartial, agreed-upon-beforehand, public contract. If a civil case is brought up the full details of the contract would need to be publicly available, posted before the case was brought against the defendant, to be used as evidence.

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PostPosted: July 24th, 2016, 7:47 pm 
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I'm assuming that in order to be brought to court, the evidence should be written and signed books in game?

Perhaps the people involved will have the same book, but each person signs a copy and gives the copy they signed to the other person?

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PostPosted: July 24th, 2016, 8:02 pm 
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King

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Interesting point, though I wouldn't have thought that would be a requirement. Statements in the diplomatic and judicial sections of the forums can of course be legally binding (and have been many many times in the past) and as they are universally and publicly accessible they are the standard that seems to make the most sense for a legal definition. I predict books will certainly be incorporated into contracts for aesthetic purposes, but I would have said it makes sense to have the forums-hosted Imperial Court be the official, legal factor here.

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PostPosted: July 24th, 2016, 8:11 pm 
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Nicholas wrote:
Interesting point, though I wouldn't have thought that would be a requirement. Statements in the diplomatic and judicial sections of the forums can of course be legally binding (and have been many many times in the past) and as they are universally and publicly accessible they are the standard that seems to make the most sense for a legal definition. I predict books will certainly be incorporated into contracts for aesthetic purposes, but I would have said it makes sense to have the forums-hosted Imperial Court be the official, legal factor here.


What about agreements that players don't want to be public knowledge? Hasn't that happened before?

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PostPosted: July 24th, 2016, 8:56 pm 
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King

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I don't doubt it. In that perfectly legal and plausible case, if the parties involved in the contract do not wish to publicly disclose the existence of a deal or the details in question, then in my opinion they do not have the evidence necessary for their contract to be officially recognized and enforceable by the Imperial Court. A civil case brought without the benefit of evidence that is both a) universally publicly accessible (on the forums) and b) containing details verified to have been agreed upon beforehand (as the forum timestamp allows for) would not hold sufficient weight to find the perpetrator of fraud guilty, so I feel this law can only be effectively enforced if contracts are specifically recognized as legal only if posted publicly.

Sorry, typing on my phone here. I'd be glad to go into more depth regarding my thoughts here as soon as I get home in under an hour.

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PostPosted: July 25th, 2016, 6:59 pm 
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Duke

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If someone does not want their contract's language to be public, they can always establish it through PM's and screenshot the conversation. This would require different language, though.

Also, we may want to extend this to contracts within realms, such as those between vassal and liege and, potentially, multiple vassals beneath the same liege (though these might be better enforced by said liege).

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PostPosted: July 26th, 2016, 12:17 am 
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King

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Good points there Chairman, screenshoting private contractual points if wished to be kept secret would be a solid idea. They would be presented at the case and kept as private as needed to be of course during and after.

We're getting there on the discussion, this is excellent work.

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PostPosted: July 26th, 2016, 12:22 am 
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Samyrrah Almandine wrote:
Good points there Chairman, screenshoting private contractual points if wished to be kept secret would be a solid idea. They would be presented at the case and kept as private as needed to be of course during and after.

We're getting there on the discussion, this is excellent work.


Unfortunately that is really easy to fake. It's easy for anyone to edit what is on a webpage via their browser ( only shows up for you, not everyone else) and take a screenshot.

Signed in-game items would be far superior.

Example: Image

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